Winds of Chaos

Would someone mind helping me with the following questions about starting species talents please, based on the pre-gen characters in the starter set:

1) How many species talents does a character start with?
The reason I ask is that all the characters from the Starter Set have a number of talents that have me confused about starting species talents.

On page 36 of the WHFRP rulebook it states that "Each Species has a variety of Skills and Talents to choose from...If a Talent listing presents a choice, you select one Talent from the choices given. Any Random Talents are determined by the Random Talent table. If you roll a Talent you already have, you may reroll.”
The talent choices for a Human are
Talents: Doomed, Savvy or Suave, 3 Random Talents
2) Is this to be read: Doomed AND (Savvy or Suave) AND 3 Random
Or
3) Doomed OR (Savvy or Suave) OR 3 Random

Confusingly, the human characters in the starter set have the following talents:
Salundra: Luck, Noble Blood, Read/Write, Savvy, Warrior Born
Ferdinand: Petty Magic, Read/Write, Savvy, Coolheaded
Else: Resolute, Night Vision, Coolheaded, Read/Write
4)How are these starting species talents possible? None of them even have Doomed?

All of the pre-gen characters (humans, dwarf, halfling, elf) from the Starter Set have starting talents that are confusing - the halfling doesn't have the Small Talent...

I’m so confused…

Thanks in advance!

I read it as Doomed AND (Savvy or Suave).*

Otherwise, I don't see the point of including the OR between the two.

Unless it's written as a proper sentence, e.g. You may select a talent from Doomed, Savvy or Suave.

I didn't because it just looks like a list. Talents: Doomed, Savvy or Suave, 3 random talents.

I think the stuff from the Starter set is wrong, particularly as you observe that Else is missing the Small Talent.

*Wouldn't it be great if the authors had to write this code.

In regards to starting talents based on race: the comma denotes a talent you get, with any (talent OR talent) meaning to choose one and random talents rolled for.

Example- humans have: Doomed, Savvy OR Suave, 3 Random talents. This means they get doomed, choose between Savvy and Suave, and then roll three times, taking what's rolled even if they get the same talent again.

The starter set has been noted as not using these generation rules, in the spirit of their belief the rules should all be seen as optional. Any comments you may have in regards to how this makes you feel have likely already be said loudly and colorfully by me already at some point.

Starter set chargen is definitely not done according to the main rules and that really pissed me off as it's not what I expect for a Starter set which should step you through getting started similarly the rules in the Starter are also different to the core rulebook. The lack of playtesting and rushed development really shows with things like this. The lack of a FAQ for more than nine months after initial release and the hordes of questions that are down to poorly written/explained wording is just not good enough. The piss poor layout with scraps of rules all over the book remind me of the issues with One Ring slip case edition.

BTW it's Doomed plus one of the other two and three random Talents.

I notice there are a couple of minor unclarities and errors in the responses made so far, so let me clear things up.

1) How many species talents does a character start with?
A Human generally starts with five (5) Talents:

The first is Doomed.
The second is either Savvy or Suave.
The remaining three are randomly rolled.

Note: the rules say you may reroll. You don't have to reroll. Remember, taking several levels of a Talent is frequently useful in 4E. For example, if your three rolls are 47, 45 and 46: Night Vision, Night Vision... and Night Vision. If you like, you can keep all three rolls, which, assuming an Initiative Characteristics of at least 30, allows you to see into 60 yards of darkness, and gives you +3 SL to any low-light Perception test (a huge bonus).

So you could end up with Doomed, Savvy and Night Vision as your five Talents.

4) How are these starting species talents possible? None of them even have Doomed?
They simply don't follow the rules. Or the Games Master don't bother with Doomed (I know I don't).

CapnZapp wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2019 2:23 pm If you like, you can keep all three rolls, which, assuming an Initiative Characteristics of at least 30, allows you to see into 60 yards of darkness, and gives you +3 SL to any low-light Perception test (a huge bonus).

Well, just to be clear, +3 SL to any successful low-light Perception tests (it can't make a failed test a success).

Correct. (All Talent Bonuses from the "Test:" line works this way)